Burning Desire to Share
I have been a alcoholic from the age of 13. I went and got help... I stopped at he age of 35... life was real I could see the world... I have started drinking again..Im in so much paion now
Hope and pray you make it back.
The doors of A.A.never close regardless of what you have done. Stpo the pain go to a meeting. Keep it simple.
T.J. Marathon, N.Y.
Hi, I hear your pain, hit some meetings, don't fall into that pity party, you've made it before, you can do it again, if you have a sponsor, call, and pray, it will be ok :)
I hope you can make it to a meeting. I too know where you are at. Just don't drink and go to a meeting tomorrow, and the next day.
I do know how you hurt....I was in the same place at the beginning of the year . I was in fact begging God for some form of calamity to make the madness stop. A series of events made me stop. I can share more with you and offer support ....you could email me at my user name above followed by at yahoo dot com. I will pray tonight exclusively for you ....I don't know a thing about God and sometimes wonder if God is dispassionate! But all my life I have asked for help when busted and broken ...but I will try to pray as fervently as I can.
Love and Peace
Everyone has gone through those first few days of sobriety. you have been sober before, and none of this came to mind before you started drinking again. That means your like me. you are powerless over alcohol, and yes, even while sober. we have these strange mental blank spots when it comes to alcohol. My last drink was aug 13,1992. I walked out of my regular home group meeting and pickup up a drink 2 hours later. the terrible consequences never came to mind. I drank alcohol like it was water. I had no mental defence.
Some guys from my home group 12 stepped me. they babysat me until my brain cleared. they took me through the steps in the big book.
Now I try to align how I do the 12 steps with the directions in the big book. I have recoverd from my obsession with alcohol. you can too if you do what I did.
Good luck to you and God bless you!
My home group has 3 meetings some days and 5 on others. It's entirely possible not to see the same faces at every meeting. We aren't a silent group. You don't have to share but are encouraged to do so. We get our share of new comers and court ordered listeners. One thing that used bother me was what I thought was a lack of politeness by some who would text and play games on their cell phones during the meeting. Some would actually sleep during the meeting and wake up to have their appearance document signed.
These things don't bother me any longer. I had to learn to accept people as they came through the door. Just like they accepted me. I'm not there to make people mind or accept me or the program. I'm not made to go to meetings by the court. I go because I genuinely care to go and have been helped by AA. I've met some very nice people through AA.
My alcoholism progressed for 35 years. I'm still experiencing the consequences. I want to help anyone who has this disease make it in recovery. I still take it one day at a time. Most times I go on autopilot and let God handle my day. I like it when he takes over. I don't take tomorrow to bed with me. Who am I to presume I have a tomorrow? The promises are materializing for me more and more. I'm 1 year 6 months sober. Happy one day at a time.
Sounds like you are on a good track. The only alcoholic I can sober up is this one and I sometimes need to put blinders on to accomplish that. I'm no one's higher power, I don't know if a guy needs the AA message or a nap. Yes, your honor, he was here.
Need a trick to keep from choking someone who doesn't know when to shut up? Start at five hundred and mentally count backwards by sevens. 500-493-486... I guarantee you won't get to zero and won't hear a word they say.
We do what we have to.
Tonight Will be my first meeting after 13 years of sobriety then 5 years of daily drinking.. The loneliness at home is almost killing me. I hope all the talk about how going to AA now is lonesome isn't true, cause I can't handle anymore of that.. I have 4 days sober and will be visiting an all woman's group tonight, here's hoping...
I have been in the program for over 13 years. i relapsed when I had 5 then again when i had 7. i was using a subsatnce for 4 years. I now have 1 year and almost 6 months back. The insnaity of this disease is what was the worst. That is all behind me now. You know how it is in early sobriety. hang in thee and don't pick "no matter What" You can do this
Laurie: hang in there. I had 9 years sober and 12 years of drinking after. I now have a bit over 2 years. It was great coming back to the fellowship and it was difficult at times.
The loneliness the first year was horrible. I was putting so much pressure on myself to meet people and running away form the loneliness it made it worse.
30-60 days in, your brain and body are still healing so you will have those feelings of depression, frustration and loneliness as a result.
I still have those moments however, am able to realize now that these moments pass quickly.
The greatest thing I did was develop my relationship with my higher power and when those moments come up I reflect on the fact that I am not alone.
Keep coming back it does work.
I did the same thing after 9 years 11 months and 10 days of sobriety I took a drink thinking " well if it gets bad I will get back to AA and sober up in a jiffy" ....I have barely put together 6 months and 22 days this time and am seeking desperately to get to meetings. I have a nice new car in the garage but the license maybe reissued only in June 2015. Of course my license was revoked because my picture on it was too handsome ( ha ha ) and on May 22nd Mr. Smirnoff and Mr. Walker and I were driving the same car at the same time. Actually I feel rather tranquil and warm just writing these words to to you.
Take care be well and prosperous
I was sober for over 10 years.. I went out drinking and my life is a mess..
After 13 years Sober, But only attending AA for two of those years, I thought all of a sudden how my life had changed so much for the better that I would be able to drink sociably again (why were all these people allowed to have fun and not me) Well 4 years down the road drinking daily, hiding it (so I think) I have been detoxing on my own for 3 days now and will be attending my first meeting tomorrow night. One just for women to start. During those 13 years I was working full time running two kids around and had a lot on my plate. I have a wonderful husband now, who works a lot (I hide this from him, again not really, well the liters I drink anyways) just a mental game I play with myself. I am so lonely and have never had many friends and none that knew of my problem. I left that group behind when I First Joined AA 17 tears ago and never looked back. I was just looking up meetings thinking i should probably get to as many as possible so I won't be so alone. I'm also a little nervous about running into people I know since I'm now in a small town. I sent my son who'17 a text today apologizing for my behavior this past weekend. Although I don't really know what I did but was said to be pretty bad by my husband whom I still told I wasn't drunk... Wow. I can say That I have never woke up a day and been glad I drank the day/night before and once I started normally early it didn't stop. My most important question to you here is do you think I should have my husband take my son to at least a couple al-anon meetings so he can at least understand the past few years before I lose him... He's coming up to 18 and my biggest fear is loosing him cause his mom WAS a drunk... Thanks for letting me share.
I know you were writing to get help for yourself, with this question about your son and al-anon (and I have no idea what you should do about that) but your post helped ME.
I got online today --googled AA -- because I woke up hungover (again) and I am full of shame. I was sober for 10 years, but only active as an AA member for about 3. I cleaned up my life, got married, had kids, and, eventually felt that I was a new person and started to drink again -- that was in 2002, just a bit at first -- very controlled -- but, for the past 5 years I've been guzzling wine down pretty much daily. I feel awful about it. I feel like I'm failing my kids -- 15 and 18 -- and that I wasted these precious years with them and they'll be gone soon. I was sober during their early years, but they probably can't even remember that.
Whenever I get really low and tell my husband I'm going to join AA again, he talks me out of it (because he likes to drink and enjoys drinking with me-- also I think he's afraid of change). I guess I've been feeling like a freak and that there aren't other people with my story (duh -- I should know better, but that's where I go). I relate to so many aspects of your post and about not remembering what you said to your son -- I don't black out, but i get really foggy at night and can't quite remember clearly what I said or did and I feel so bad about that, for my kids.
Occasionally, I'll think of going to a meeting, but, like you, I don't want to run into people I know. And I live in NYC! I have a lot of trepidation. Before when I I got sober, I was single -- now, there are so many people involved in my life, I'm afraid to make a big change and think I can just try to manage my drinking better, somehow and keep the status quo.
Thanks for sharing and it makes me remember how AA works: how sharing your pain and experience inadvertently helps someone else who's suffering. I feel a little less freaky reading your post, because it's so similar to my experience. I don't know what I'm going to do, but this is my first attempt to connect with AA since 2002.
If you know what your "most important question is" after detoxing for three days, you're way ahead of me and I just picked up a coin with the Serenity Prayer one side and several "X's" on the other.
Running your own life is apt to be a full time job. More than that for most. Cemeteries and prisons are full of them.
Word count in your post:
I hope you make it, It is indeed a wonderful life.
What worked for my child was KNOWING that I was going to meetings and not drinking. She drives me to some meetings on the weekends. It took a while for her to trust me again. A year in fact. My daughter will be 18 soon as well. She will leave the nest knowing she has a sober father. Not a father who always made the best decisions, but one who loved her unconditionally. My decision to join AA has been the best decision I've ever made. Don't worry if you're from a small town. People will gossip as long as there are people to gossip about. Don't gossip back and let it pass you by. I have to work on myself and pray for them.
I had the same fear when I went to a meeting in my hometown where I grew up. It was funny. The meeting house was one block from where I used to live and some of my childhood friends were at the meeting. Some who thought I had died. We had a wonderful time catching up. Bunch of used to be drunks laughing at ourselves for what We used to think was cool.
If it was me, I'd let my son drive me and drop me off to a few meetings. Pick me up after. Then go get an Ice cream. He'd need to know I was serious about getting back into the program. I'd find a sponsor as soon as I could as well. I'd invite my sponsor over to meet the family. I'd ask God for help. I'd pray and mean it.
Hang in there. Don't worry about your son yet. All you need to do is go to meetings and don't drink one day at a time. Everything else will work out! And best of luck to you. Today is the first day of the rest of your life!
All the best,
We are two brothers in AA sober more than 3 years. Somebody in AA told me that if there are two brothers in AA, one of them only remain sober for long time. And generally the one which people think that he or she will not remain sober. I am dreaded with this thought. Do you know any two bothers in AA who are sober for long time ?
I recently graduated a treatment center where we were told that statistically only 2 of "us" will "make" it to long term sobriety. Funny thing is no-one but God (my Higher Power)can know who will make it and who wont. this "sombody" must like to hear themselves talk.
You say you have 3 years in the program? are you serious after 3 years you really entertain nonsense like this.
I have two brothers in AA for quite a few days. I came to AA in November of 1971. My younger brother followed me in June of 1972.My youngest brother came in July of 1991. By the grace of God we are all still sober giving us a combined 105 years of sobriety.My younger brother has a son with 15 sober years in the program and another son who is struggling to get sober.
I'm in AA. I will tell you if there are two brothers in AA, if one of them remains sober, they both will, but if one relapses, the other will stay sober. Be the sober brother.
I know numerous sets of brothers, father/sons, mother/daughter, and countless BFF (best friends forever) Some sober, some not. Being an anonymous AA means we hang our titles on a hook outside the meeting room. In AA we're just alcoholics. In the rooms we're just individuals trying to stay sober ourselves
know many brothers who are sober and stayed sober. some drink, some don't. the brothers that have a sponsor, home. group, and apply the 12 steps stay sober and grow. the brothers that donr, usually drink . just. like ever other alcoholic.
"Burn the idea into the consciousness of every man that he can get well regardless of anyone. The only condition is that he trust in God and clean house."
Alcoholics Anonymous p98
Makes it clear to me that I can get well regardless of anything my brother or anyone else does IF I do the two things required.
Truer words were never written. I'm on every page of the big book. It was written for me and countless others.
Ask the clown what page the myth about two brothers is on?
If I have a meeting with Bill W (reading AA literature) for every face to face meeting that I attend, I can recognize BS (Bad Sense) a mile away. So can you.
By God's grace I had my last drink in 1970. My brother,
three years younger, drank another twenty years. We had started drinking around the same time.
He just completed 23 years without a drink. I personally
know twin brothers who are sober for three decades.
Share your AA life with your brother, if possible.
My brother is in another state, but we attend meetings
together when we visit. So don't dread; Enjoy. ANONYMOUS
I am brand new at this, went for two weeks sober, which I never thought I could do, then had one incident where I backslid and drank after being triggered by a traumatic conversation with an abusive partner. I have since gone to another meeting and made plans for a temporary sponsor and plans with new AA friends to meet up, have lunch and go to meetings together. I am also seeing my therapist and on meds. It just seems like I feel constantly drained lately, but going to meetings gives me some hope to see others have done it.
I just hope I can survive my next interaction with the abusive partner and not backslide again after all the hard work.
I have lost my appetite, is this normal? I am eating but just not hungry much.
Also I am feeling isolated after having to turn down social invites for drinks, and such.
Im sure it gets easier, but I have to say these first few weeks have been very emotional and tough. Suggestions welcomed.
Years ago when I got sober, I had been in an abusive marriage for 17 years and drank the whole time. At first, I felt like I woke up to a nightmare in front of me, abusive husband and dysfunctional children and my own life unmanageable. To stay sober, I went to lots of meetings, I read the Big Book and listened to AA tapes when not at meetings. and I talked a lot and socialized a lot with AA people.I also found a sponsor to do 4th step and 5th step inventory. I had to keep reminding myself that I was trying to stay sober despite the terrible situation around me and that it would GET BETTER. I also keep thinking, "DONT DRINK even if your butt falls off", "Let Go and Let God" and "Never give up". I did have one slip the first year and another the second year, but I finally started asking God every day to keep me sober and after that I stayed sober.In the beginning I had forgotten to do that because I was so overwhelmed with my problems, I didn't focus on solutions. I now have almost 29years sobriety and during that time all my problems got solved and I have been happy, joyous and free for many,many years. The healing and recovery doesn't come fast, so you have to learn patience and we alcoholics are not patient. We want sobriety to the fullest right away. Take it one day at a time and keep reminding yourself WHY you want to stay sober. For me it was to get rid of the pain and to do that I had to stop drinking first, because that only covered up the pain and I couldn't heal. You can write me anytime if you have other questions. Mary Jo
Congratulations on two weeks! One thing that was suggested to me when I first came in was to read page 417 of the Big Book. It may be helpful. I found that going to ninety meetings in ninety days, getting a sponsor, reading the literature, working the steps and getting active by taking a job in a group were all very helpful to keeping me sober one day at a time.
I never experienced lack of appetite, but this too shall pass, I am sure.
I stopped going out with those people who I knew just wanted to drink, but I frequently travel on business in which there is drinking and by "maintaining my spiritual condition", I am able to be around alcohol without it being a problem now. I have replaced these interactions with AA and other activities that I enjoy.
It does get easier.
Much love to you too :-)
dearest friends, i am struggling every day. i am going for a two day vacation with a sober friend to florida for some sun this weekend. any words of wisdom? wine by the pool and on the beach is something i cant imagine not doing. i dont like who i become when i drink and certainly not how i feel the next day. but i want to have fun! help
Solving your problem is exactly what AA's program of recovery is all about. An honest look at my life revealed that I couldn't control alcohol after drinking a small amount, I couldn't stay away from it and I denied the first two facts. I needed to be somebody else to get rid of the problems that alcohol caused. AA did that for me. I kept the fun and lost the booze. My wife too. I think we have spent over a hundred days on cruises out of Florida without a drink and no, we don't miss it. We've replaced it with something much better.
Many think about cruises and beach vacations as drinking occasions and many do. Once a year some allow themselves a few drinks and get tipsy or maybe even enough to get a hangover. Looking around the ship, most don't even do that. Vacations are drinking occasions for US. Everything becomes a drinking occasion for us.
If the thought crosses my mind of how nice a glass of wine or a Manhattan would taste going down it's now followed by the thought "But how does it taste coming back up?". I'm an alcoholic, I can't have one without the other.
I'd trade that wine for some great Ice cream I haven't had in a while or an extra large frozen lemonade. I'd think of what I did for fun at the beach when I was a young kid? I'd take me a sand bucket and build a sand castle. I'd body surf, look for odd shells, read a good book or play on my phone and catch some rays. I might try my hand at surf fishing. I might find an arcade and whip somebody at pinball. I'd go to the amusement park and ride all the scary rides. I might want to rent a bike and see the sights. Best of all, I'd Relax, Relax, Relax. Napping is good too.Daydream happy things. I'd find so much to do or not do that drinking alcohol would never enter my mind.
It's Good that you going with a sober friend. Have fun and cover that nose with good sunscreen. May God watch over you in your travels.
On mine, it not the best variant
People tell me im going to too many meetings and I need to get a life outside aa. I go every night get up in the mornings work hard help my mum and dad. Talk to my sponsor who goes every night
Early in sobriety when I was unemployed, single, living in my parent's basement and detoxing from the many ill effects of alcoholism I went to lots of meetings - sometimes 2-3 per day. My sponsor asked that I attend one Step meeting per week with him at our home group.
I built a new life around AA(steps), AA friends, AA activities and recovery. I slowly healed and learned how to live in this world happily without alcohol. As my life filled up with work, relationships, hobbies, family, children and career - my priorities changed. Though AA/sobriety is still my main priority, I now have other responsibilities that compete for my time and attention.
It doesn't matter what others say about you, don't let them run your life. You are an adult right? Then you can make your own dicisions. There is no such thing as going to too many meetings, that's ridiculous. I help my parents, work hard, and go to as many meetings as I can, and I'm over 2 years sober. Remember the triangle.
As an alcoholic, I have a real talent for doing exactly what I want and deciding that's what's BEST. Usually what I want is what makes me feel good. Meetings fit that category. I mix in some meetings with Bill W (reading AA books) to see if people have any idea what they are talking about in meetings. Not as much fun but like eating my vegetables, necessary. I can usually pick out Mr AA's house on a block. Its the one with the broken sidewalk and hasn't seen a paint brush for twenty years.
If you use meetings to learn how to use the AA program between meetings, you're on a good track. If you're setting in a meeting chair watching others use the program, it's like sitting on the Titanic watching others use the life boats.
I, like you, love meetings. When the alcoholic in me rears it's head, I know the best place to be is in a meeting where I am loved and tolerated. Thank god for Alcoholics Anonymous...both the groups and book.
if ur new, go to as many as u can.
if ur 10 years sober and leave your wife and family to spend 4 hours a day at meetings, then yes something's wrong. remember balance.
People tell me im going to too many meetings and I need to get a life outside aa. I go every night get up in the mornings work hard help my mum and dad. Talk to my sponsor who goes every night
"18 million people in the US and Canada suffer from a life threatening problem". I often wonder how
such estimates are developed. The figures I have seen for the past few years have been closer to
30 million. Are less people becoming alcoholic, or are the alcoholics dying at an earlier age.
Our nonalcoholic Chairman of the Board of Trustees writes in a final NERF report: "Not drinking
is not the solution".
I believe that the solution is all about not drinking. Recovery from this fatal illness depends
on that one thing.
Bill W. recovered in Dec 1934. Not by "works", but by the grace of God. After almost six months
of trying to help other drunks to recover, he stumbled onto a method, technique, gadget, of transferring
relief to other alcoholic sufferers. It is a very unusual, almost strange, means of reaching other
alcoholics at great depth. This method is explained on page 70 in "Alcoholics Anonymous Comes of Age".
If we approach the new prospect from a position of humility and weakness, he/she will almost always
We have over a million sober members of A.A. in the US and Canada, whose primary purpose is to stay
sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety. Last year our membership increased by
less than 5,000. We have fewer members in A.A. today (worldwide), than we had in 1992. Some may say
well, 5,000 is almost 15 per day. With 65,000 AA groups is that the best we can do. IMO that is
appalling and just not acceptable. Why are we accepting it? No, the solution is not to throw more
money at the problem. It will cost us more than money. Our pride, EGO, conceit, and arrogance are
what we have to give up. Are we willing? Can we make that sacrifice, in order to help other
suffering alcoholics, 18 million or 30 million. They are waiting and suffering. ANONYMOUS
I reside in the Twin Cities area of Minnesota. I am on the Treatment Committee for our district. We have no problem finding groups to bring meetings into treatment facilities and correction institutions. There are some members that are of the "preacher" type, but they are few and far between; and I have no power to change their tactics other than to supply them with the information contained in our supplementary literature and books. And I thank you for all of your useful references! I don't know what our success rate is here, nor do I care.
Being spiritually fit, happy joyous and free, I think that we offer a great alternative to daily drinking. By sheer numbers of recovered (from the daily obsession to drink) and happy alcoholics, we can do what Bill couldn't by himself.
We are staying sober the best way we can; we practice group, district and area inventories to try to improve; We see our rooms filling up at certain times and then leveling off. With the economy doing better, our rooms aren't filling up as fast.
If you are not seeing progress in your area, I wish you wouldn't condemn A.A. as a whole as being in a cycle of decline. Numbers do not provide all the answers. They can be a strong indicator of course. But lets work on practical solutions.
So to start off with. What area are you in that you are experiencing these problems? What have you tried to do about these issues? How can we help you?
faith without works is dead- "AA big book". Please reread bill's story in the big book. He explains the "work" he did to induce his spiritual experience. On page 13 of the big book, bill describes what later became steps 3-12 in his own words. steps 1 and 2 are described earlier in his story.
I hope you take the time to read bill's story again. I do fully agree with the cart before the horse idea. I use it at the jail and detox meetings I join in each week. I also agree that AA is on a steady decline. I believe it's because we have gotten away from our singlness of purpose and have allowed treatment centers and counselors to water down the program of AA to the point of losing it's effectiveness. I believe the program and the fellowship at one time were one and the same. you called AA, members took you through the steps, then you went to meetings to discuss and listen to how you work the steps in your daily life. Today's open discussion meetings sound more like a group therapy session than AA.
The program (12steps) still work if you put half the effort you did into it as you did your drinking. I have never seen them fail. the 4 guys I took through the steps so far this year are still sober and doing well, that's 100% so far this year. I wonder how many other methods are running 100% this year? NO worries, AA is alive and well in my neighborhood.
This is what the founders did,
This is what I do,
This is the success rate.
I am not trying to be argumentative. That has never been
my aim. I am just trying to "save AA". If every member of
AA saved one new alcoholic a year, our membership would
be exploding. You certainly seem to be doing your part.
I am only trying to explain, and point out how and why
our precious fellowship has lost much or most of its effectiveness in helping suffering alcoholics.
Bill W. was not "working" when he had that spiritual
awakening. He was quitting, surrendering, giving up. He
did not earn sobriety. It was given to him by the Grace
of God. I think that in the ten years prior to his death
Bill became convinced that he did work for it
and earn it.
We should have no differences or problems with treatment
centers or counselors, if we do our job, and allow them
to do theirs. We could be working effectively side by
side. By combining the two we have blundered. And it
is our blunder.
You believe that AA is on a steady decline. Based on
membership numbers I would say we are stagnant, with
less members than we had twenty years ago. That has
been my concern, a real concern. If we don't grow, we will
go. But my greatest concern is for those who are approaching us now. We are not using the "cart before the
horse" IDEA offered to Bill by Dr. Silkworth. I don't
believe you have an understanding of the IDEA or how it
is to be used. Bill explains it several times in his writings. Lack of understanding of this IDEA is the cause
of our steady decline. What we are lacking is humility.
Spiritual pride is the enemy.
Faith without works is dead. Works without Faith can
be just as dead. We cannot work ourselves into sobriety,
although most AA members think that is the method.
The true AA method is described in AACA page 70. ANONYMOUS
Anonymous writes, “Bill W. was not "working" when he had that spiritual
awakening. He was quitting, surrendering, giving up. He
did not earn sobriety. “
I understand your not trying to be argumentative, but you are. So for fun, I’ll join in. Bill was absolutely “working”. This is a classic case of spreading the disease instead of the message. Bill’s story in the big book describes exactly how he worked what is now AA’s 12 steps although they were not written when he took them. Ebby showed Bill how to take them. Pages 13 and 14 of Bill’s story in the big book describe Bill working steps 3-11. Steps 1 and 2 are prior to page 13 in Bill’s story. “Then” Bill had a spiritual experience. That is precisely why AA has 12 steps. You work the steps, you get a spiritual experience that will expel your compulsion to drink and make you usefully and happily whole. Then to keep his spiritual experience, he had to give it away. That is spelled out in pages 15 and 16.
The big book chapter discreetly titled “How it Works” just happens to have the 12 steps in it. I don’t think the chapter has an ambiguous title. I think it means what it says. Even Dr. Bob said the steps are simple in meaning and will always work if you put half as much zeal in to the program as you did into getting another drink. The method to sobriety is not in a couple paragraphs in Language of the Heart. The Method to sobriety in AA is clearly spelled out in the first 164 pages if the book “ Alcoholics Anonymous”. That book by the way was intended to prevent the simple message of AA from being garbled over time. I see much garbling in the constant posts of our message being in language of the heart. Bill’s messages are in language of the heart. The AA message is in the Big book, written by Bill W and proofed by Dr Bob, the Akron and New York drunks. Anything in that book had to go through everybody. That way no bleeding deacon could force us all to believe a lie.
"Ebby showed Bill how to take them". Bill said that Ebby
did no preaching. Ebby did not instruct Bill on how to take
the twelve steps. Ebby only told Bill what had been his
experience. Ebby laid the tools at Bill's feet. He did not
try to cram the steps down Bill's throat. That is where
we have gone wrong. We have made the steps mandatory,
instead of offering them as suggestions.
"proofed by Dr. Bob, etc.". Bill wrote the Big Book,
he was the author. The chapters were sent to Dr. Bob and
the others for approval. But one great exception was the
objections from the agnostics and atheists. "As we understand Him" was added, and the Big Book and the steps
were to be offered to prospects as suggestive. ANONYMOUS